sunnuntai 8. huhtikuuta 2018 3.38.39 UTC+3 Trevor Wilson kirjoitti:


**The LS3/5a is the most over-rated piece of junk ever to be foisted on
the audio industry.


Agreed.

Iain

In article ,
Trevor Wilson wrote:
The LS 3/5a has a rectangle of felt round the tweeter, but not the
bass/midrange.


**The LS3/5a is the most over-rated piece of junk ever to be foisted on
the audio industry. It's continued existence is adequate evidence that
most listeners believe what some reviewers say, rather than listening
for themselves.

You've said this before. Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears. That's not to say they ain't over hyped by some. Same as
every single bit of sound equipment ever made.

Don't get me started on LS3/5a speakers. And don't tell me how the BBC
designed them. The idiot who designed them should be shot.

No BBC speaker was designed by just one person. Always a team.

--
*Frustration is trying to find your glasses without your glasses.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article , Trevor Wilson
wrote:
The LS 3/5a has a rectangle of felt round the tweeter, but not the
bass/midrange.


**The LS3/5a is the most over-rated piece of junk ever to be foisted
on the audio industry. It's continued existence is adequate evidence
that most listeners believe what some reviewers say, rather than
listening for themselves.

You've said this before. Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears. That's not to say they ain't over hyped by some. Same as
every single bit of sound equipment ever made.

FWIW I find the LS3/5a works OK for the kind of purpose I think it was
designed to deal with. Items like voice and classical music at low repro
levels in a confined space. It has obvious limitations in terms of bass
and signal levels, but seems voiced to give an indication of what you'd
get from bigger better speakers in a larger room with a decent acoustic.

I doubt it would suit those into rock music, etc. 8-]

I don't doubt there are alternative small speakers which can give better
results. But the advantage of a BBC spec is that it is a 'known quantity'.
Again, part of the reason for its existence.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa...o/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On 8/04/2018 10:13 PM, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Trevor Wilson wrote:
The LS 3/5a has a rectangle of felt round the tweeter, but not the
bass/midrange.


**The LS3/5a is the most over-rated piece of junk ever to be foisted on
the audio industry. It's continued existence is adequate evidence that
most listeners believe what some reviewers say, rather than listening
for themselves.

You've said this before.

**Have I? Cite.


Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears.

**I am well aware of the delusions practiced by many listeners. The goal
of a high fidelity system is to recreate, as closely as possible, the
original musical event. The LS3/5a is incapable of performing this.
Other small speakers can do the job far more convincingly.


That's not to say they ain't over hyped by some. Same as
every single bit of sound equipment ever made.

**Nope. Many products lack hype and are allowed to disappear into
obscurity, if they are found to be lacking. For some odd reason, the
LS3/5a continues to be manufactured.


Don't get me started on LS3/5a speakers. And don't tell me how the BBC
designed them. The idiot who designed them should be shot.

No BBC speaker was designed by just one person. Always a team.

**Line 'em all up against the wall.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

In article ,
Trevor Wilson wrote:
You've said this before.

**Have I? Cite.

I don't keep posts to this group. Are you saying quite categorically you
haven't said similar before?


Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears.

**I am well aware of the delusions practiced by many listeners.

Not 'listeners'. The 3/5s was made for pro use. And very highly regarded
by them. For the job it was intended to do.


The goal
of a high fidelity system is to recreate, as closely as possible, the
original musical event.

Ah - right. What sort of music would that be?


The LS3/5a is incapable of performing this.

Yes - it's not very good at reproducing a 32ft stop.

Other small speakers can do the job far more convincingly.

Given the 3/5a was designed some 50 years ago it would be quite surprising
if others hadn't caught up.

But you might also remember a large amount of the BBC output is speech.
And there are plenty rated 'music' speakers that sound dreadful on that.

--
*(over a sketch of the titanic) "The boat sank - get over it

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 9/04/2018 8:19 AM, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Trevor Wilson wrote:
You've said this before.

**Have I? Cite.

I don't keep posts to this group. Are you saying quite categorically you
haven't said similar before?

**In this group? I doubt it.



Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears.

**I am well aware of the delusions practiced by many listeners.

Not 'listeners'.

**I hate to burst your bubble, but that is precisely what ALL
loudspeakers are for. They are expressly designed for humans to listen
to sound through. Therefore, a human that listens to (say) music through
a pair (or more) of speakers, is, by definition, a listener.


The 3/5s was made for pro use. And very highly regarded
by them. For the job it was intended to do.

**I have as much regard for "pros" as I do for amateurs. Pros are just
as prone to delusion as amateurs.



The goal
of a high fidelity system is to recreate, as closely as possible, the
original musical event.

Ah - right. What sort of music would that be?

**That would be musical music.



The LS3/5a is incapable of performing this.

Yes - it's not very good at reproducing a 32ft stop.

**I make allowances for speakers, depending on what they are designed to
do.


Other small speakers can do the job far more convincingly.

Given the 3/5a was designed some 50 years ago it would be quite surprising
if others hadn't caught up.

**THAT, is precisely my point! 50 years ago, the LS3/5a was a decent
enough small speaker (and by "decent", I mean, OK, but far from
outstanding). In 2018, it is a piece of ****. It should have been
consigned to the dustbin of history years ago.



But you might also remember a large amount of the BBC output is speech.
And there are plenty rated 'music' speakers that sound dreadful on that.

**Name them.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

On 8/04/2018 11:47 PM, Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article , Trevor Wilson
wrote:
The LS 3/5a has a rectangle of felt round the tweeter, but not the
bass/midrange.


**The LS3/5a is the most over-rated piece of junk ever to be foisted
on the audio industry. It's continued existence is adequate evidence
that most listeners believe what some reviewers say, rather than
listening for themselves.

You've said this before. Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears. That's not to say they ain't over hyped by some. Same as
every single bit of sound equipment ever made.

FWIW I find the LS3/5a works OK for the kind of purpose I think it was
designed to deal with. Items like voice and classical music at low repro
levels in a confined space. It has obvious limitations in terms of bass
and signal levels, but seems voiced to give an indication of what you'd
get from bigger better speakers in a larger room with a decent acoustic.

I doubt it would suit those into rock music, etc. 8-]

I don't doubt there are alternative small speakers which can give better
results. But the advantage of a BBC spec is that it is a 'known quantity'.
Again, part of the reason for its existence.


**And therein lies the problem. Despite it's long, long list of flaws,
professionals stick with a horrible loudspeaker, despite the clear and
obvious advantages of the alternatives. It's not too different to the
situation in the US, a couple of decades ago. It was said: "No engineer
who designed a recording studio was fired for specifying JBL speakers."

This, despite the fact that there were and are, many other alternatives
that offer far superior performance at similar cost.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

On Mon, 9 Apr 2018 19:47:24 +1000, Trevor Wilson
wrote:

On 8/04/2018 11:47 PM, Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article , Trevor Wilson
wrote:
The LS 3/5a has a rectangle of felt round the tweeter, but not the
bass/midrange.


**The LS3/5a is the most over-rated piece of junk ever to be foisted
on the audio industry. It's continued existence is adequate evidence
that most listeners believe what some reviewers say, rather than
listening for themselves.

You've said this before. Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears. That's not to say they ain't over hyped by some. Same as
every single bit of sound equipment ever made.

FWIW I find the LS3/5a works OK for the kind of purpose I think it was
designed to deal with. Items like voice and classical music at low repro
levels in a confined space. It has obvious limitations in terms of bass
and signal levels, but seems voiced to give an indication of what you'd
get from bigger better speakers in a larger room with a decent acoustic.

I doubt it would suit those into rock music, etc. 8-]

I don't doubt there are alternative small speakers which can give better
results. But the advantage of a BBC spec is that it is a 'known quantity'.
Again, part of the reason for its existence.


**And therein lies the problem. Despite it's long, long list of flaws,
professionals stick with a horrible loudspeaker, despite the clear and
obvious advantages of the alternatives. It's not too different to the
situation in the US, a couple of decades ago. It was said: "No engineer
who designed a recording studio was fired for specifying JBL speakers."

This, despite the fact that there were and are, many other alternatives
that offer far superior performance at similar cost.

I don't think you'll find many professionals using the LS3/5A. Even in
the BBC they were only used in certain specific circumstances and even
the BBC started using commercial powered speakers for the job that
they used to do many years ago.

It seems to have maintained a cult status with a small group of
audiophiles who keep it alive.

In article ,
Jim Lesurf wrote:
You've said this before. Many many times. Most prefer the evidence of
their own ears. That's not to say they ain't over hyped by some. Same as
every single bit of sound equipment ever made.

FWIW I find the LS3/5a works OK for the kind of purpose I think it was
designed to deal with. Items like voice and classical music at low repro
levels in a confined space. It has obvious limitations in terms of bass
and signal levels, but seems voiced to give an indication of what you'd
get from bigger better speakers in a larger room with a decent acoustic.

Quite. That some people hype it up into being something it isn't is hardly
the fault of the speaker or designers.

For near field monitoring for pro use (and domestic) it still takes some
beating. I get the impression many of its critics have never actually
lived with a pair. And base their views on a quick audition.

--
*Time is what keeps everything from happening at once.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Trevor Wilson wrote:
Given the 3/5a was designed some 50 years ago it would be quite
surprising if others hadn't caught up.

**THAT, is precisely my point! 50 years ago, the LS3/5a was a decent
enough small speaker (and by "decent", I mean, OK, but far from
outstanding).

OK. Name a contemporary which was better. The BBC (then) didn't go to the
bother of designing their own speakers if a commercial unit as good for
their purpose could be bought.


In 2018, it is a piece of ****. It should have been
consigned to the dustbin of history years ago.

I'm afraid that just shows you are hyping things in exactly the same way
as some of its fans.

There has been no magical improvment in speaker design that makes the sort
of difference you're implying.

--
*Confession is good for the soul, but bad for your career.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.