Wow and Forum

I've recently given in and have tried joining a 'web forum' on audio (pink
fish). This seems OK, and the people are friendly, but I still find usenet
easier to use. But alas, most people seem to have migrated away from
usenet...

One thing I've been doing since is that a thread prompted me to start
writing a 'wow and flutter' measurement program. Rough as yet, but this
seems to work OK to the AES specs for such measurements. It also can give
some natty graphics. e.g.

http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/temp/polar.png

Which shows the variations plotted to rotate once per rotation of the
turntable. The program also shows the specta of variations, variations with
time, and a histogram of the speed variations along with a 'two sigma'
measurement of the amount, weighted as per the AES recommendation.

Hope to finish this off and release versions with source code in my usual
way. Then plan to experiment to see if I can produce a 'fozgometer' type
analysis, although I'm not yet convinced the idea that this helps perfect
cartridge alignment makes sense. :-)

BTW last week someone bought an Armstrong 730/732 combination on fleabay
for 1,136 quid! I'm hoping they will contact me. But I can't give them
their money back. 8-]

Cheers,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

I just wish forum software was alll the same interface wise. That would go a
great way to making them easy to use.
I simply do not understand the point of wbeb forums for subjects where the
primary use is textual.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...
I've recently given in and have tried joining a 'web forum' on audio (pink
fish). This seems OK, and the people are friendly, but I still find usenet
easier to use. But alas, most people seem to have migrated away from
usenet...

One thing I've been doing since is that a thread prompted me to start
writing a 'wow and flutter' measurement program. Rough as yet, but this
seems to work OK to the AES specs for such measurements. It also can give
some natty graphics. e.g.

http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/temp/polar.png

Which shows the variations plotted to rotate once per rotation of the
turntable. The program also shows the specta of variations, variations
with
time, and a histogram of the speed variations along with a 'two sigma'
measurement of the amount, weighted as per the AES recommendation.

Hope to finish this off and release versions with source code in my usual
way. Then plan to experiment to see if I can produce a 'fozgometer' type
analysis, although I'm not yet convinced the idea that this helps perfect
cartridge alignment makes sense. :-)

BTW last week someone bought an Armstrong 730/732 combination on fleabay
for 1,136 quid! I'm hoping they will contact me. But I can't give them
their money back. 8-]

Cheers,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics
http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote:
I just wish forum software was alll the same interface wise. That would
go a great way to making them easy to use. I simply do not understand
the point of wbeb forums for subjects where the primary use is textual.

Most forums are moderated in some way. Not to censure what is said, but to
stop the OT stuff etc that is killing newsgroups. And the ability to add
pics etc is pretty useful for most.

--
*And don't start a sentence with a conjunction *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Well maybe, but posting to them is slow and awkward, and ties up some poor
person doing the moderation. It is only of course on one server so if you
cannot get to that you cannot read it. There should be no issue with spam on
usenet as simple filters can just zap it pretty fast.
also of course many people put their graphics on dropbox or similar and
post a public link. Birian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote:
I just wish forum software was alll the same interface wise. That would
go a great way to making them easy to use. I simply do not understand
the point of wbeb forums for subjects where the primary use is textual.

Most forums are moderated in some way. Not to censure what is said, but to
stop the OT stuff etc that is killing newsgroups. And the ability to add
pics etc is pretty useful for most.

--
*And don't start a sentence with a conjunction *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote:
Well maybe, but posting to them is slow and awkward, and ties up some
poor person doing the moderation.

Not really. Most just approve new members and then let them get on with
it. Only moderate if someone gets naughty. You don't check every post.

It is only of course on one server so
if you cannot get to that you cannot read it.

No different in principle from a news server.

There should be no issue
with spam on usenet as simple filters can just zap it pretty fast. also
of course many people put their graphics on dropbox or similar and post
a public link.

That's actually how most forums work. It's your browser which inserts the
picture from the link - the pic isn't uploaded to the forum. But it just
looks like it is.

Thing is regardless of what we dinosaurs think, most have moved on to
forums - and even specialised groups on the likes of Facebook.

--
*Speak softly and carry a cellular phone *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Jim Lesurf writes:

One thing I've been doing since is that a thread prompted me to start
writing a 'wow and flutter' measurement program. Rough as yet, but this
seems to work OK to the AES specs for such measurements.

Cool! I've recently replaced the drive belts in my Aiwa AD-S950 tape
deck, and it would be nice to be able to measure what its performance is
like now...

--
Adam Sampson http://offog.org/

In article , Adam Sampson
wrote:
Jim Lesurf writes:

One thing I've been doing since is that a thread prompted me to start
writing a 'wow and flutter' measurement program. Rough as yet, but
this seems to work OK to the AES specs for such measurements.

Cool! I've recently replaced the drive belts in my Aiwa AD-S950 tape
deck, and it would be nice to be able to measure what its performance is
like now...

If you look at http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/software/index.html
you can find the RISC OS app version I put up yesterday. That does come
with the source code in 'C' which anyone is free to port to other OSs.

In addition, if you look at the 'wow and flutter' thread on the 'pink fish'
web forum you can find some linux and windows versions other people have
done.

I will also do a ROX/Linux version sometime soon, again with source code
provided. I don't use Windows/Mac so have to leave those versions to
others.

Note that as it stands, my program focusses on wow and flutter (speed
variations) in the range from 0.1 to 50 Hz. This is fine for turntable
assessment.

'Scrape' flutter on tapes might be at higher frequencies, so I'm not sure
how accurate the results from my program would be if the main flutter
variations are 50 Hz. But the stuff 50 Hz would tend to be 'folded
back' and affect the results rather than vanish entirely. I can't say for
sure as I've not considered tape flutter. For 50Hz flutter one of my FFT
programs might give clearer results.

BTW Someone has asked me about availability of test LPs in the UK.

Predictably, I have an assortment of test LPs as a paid-up audio geek. And
I tend to use a batch of the "Analogue Productions" test disc from the USA
at present. Anyone know of an alternative convenient for UK buyers?

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

Just to let people know that I have put up a Linux program for wow and
flutter measurement an analysis, linked from

http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/software/index.html

What I remain unsure about, though, is what suitable test discs are
available, new. I only know of the Analogue Productions example, which
should be OK. Anyone know of other current test discs that have stready
tones in the 1k - 10 k region?

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article ,
Jim Lesurf wrote:
Just to let people know that I have put up a Linux program for wow and
flutter measurement an analysis, linked from

http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/software/index.html

What I remain unsure about, though, is what suitable test discs are
available, new. I only know of the Analogue Productions example, which
should be OK. Anyone know of other current test discs that have stready
tones in the 1k - 10 k region?

Yes. Problem must be knowing how much of the wow and flutter comes from
the record itself.

With a decent turntable, it was often the pressing which was the problem,
not the turntable. Perhaps things have improved today.

--
*Age is a very high price to pay for maturity.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article , Jim Lesurf
wrote:
Just to let people know that I have put up a Linux program for wow and
flutter measurement an analysis, linked from

http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/software/index.html

What I remain unsure about, though, is what suitable test discs are
available, new. I only know of the Analogue Productions example, which
should be OK. Anyone know of other current test discs that have
stready tones in the 1k - 10 k region?

Yes. Problem must be knowing how much of the wow and flutter comes from
the record itself.

Sadly, yes. I can check for an off-center LP if there are tracks on the
side at various radii. But unforunately, there seem to be only a few 'new'
LPs about. The Hi Fi News one has tracks at 300 Hz which is a wee bit on
the low side for this.

The analogue productions one has useful tracks at various radii. Only one
is actually the standard 3150 Hz. But 1 kHz works fine.

I'd hoped that other examples would be available. But no sign of them so
far. :-/

I'm OK because I've collected a range of test discs over mumble years. But
a test program isn't much use to someone else if they can't get a suitable
disc!

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html